Lockout

[Grace]

I wonder if Dirk and the other NBA players that were waiting for the outcome are going to go play overseas now? I think I would. There is no point in staying here any longer. And they can always come back to the states when/if this wraps up. This is taking too long. I would at least want to stay in shape and be at my best performance when the season actually begins if it were me. There is no point in staying now.

[Michele]

NBA Commissioner David Stern has announced that ALL NBA games have been canceled through November 30. Screw the fans a bit more why don't they? They keep this B.S. up and hardly anyone is going to give a flying flip about the NBA.

[Grace]

Here is an update on the lockout: Where do NBA talks go now?

[Michele]

Apparently us Maverick fans are still honeymooning with Dirk. It seems the Mavericks are the one team that has kept a grip on fan devotion.
www.usatoday.com/sports/basketball/nba/mavericks/story/2011-10-27/mavericks-would-have-raised-NBA-championship-banner-Tuesday/51020150/1

[Grace]

NBA owners give players drop-dead offer

By Adrian Wojnarowski, Yahoo! Sports


NEW YORK – NBA commissioner David Stern delivered the Players Association a take-it-or-leave-it offer, threatening the owners’ proposals will become substantially worse if the union doesn’t accept the deal by the close of business Wednesday.

“We’ve been given the ultimatum,” union president Derek Fisher said, “and our answer is, that’s not acceptable to us.”

Union officials scoffed at Stern’s depiction of the proposal, saying the commissioner is merely trying to “strong-arm” the players into accepting a bad deal.

“The players will not be intimidated,” union attorney Jeffrey Kessler said. “They want to play, they want a season, but they are not going to sacrifice the futures of all NBA players under these threats of intimidation.

“It’s not happening. It’s not happening on Derek Fisher’s watch, it’s not happening on [union executive director] Billy Hunter’s watch.”

If the players don’t agree by Wednesday to accept the proposal – which Stern described as including a revenue split that could give the players as much as 51 percent and as little as 49 percent – then the owners’ new offer would drop to 47 percent of basketball-related income for the players and include a “flex” salary cap.

“We want to allow the union enough time to consider our most recent proposal, and we are hopeful that they will accept,” Stern said, after acknowledging Kessler had already rejected the offer.

After reports that Charlotte Bobcats owner Michael Jordan had become one of the most vocal of hardline owners, union officials were anxious for him to speak up in Saturday night’s meeting. Union officials, just as they wanted to do back at the last labor meeting that Jordan attended on All-Star weekend, were determined to throw back at Jordan many of his old anti-ownership screeds from the 1990s.

As one official said, “He never opened his mouth, not once.”

The two sides didn’t spend a great deal of the 8½ hours engaging each other, but rather had the federal mediator shuttling back and forth between rooms, a source said.

Stern’s ultimatum comes with the backdrop of player agents actively canvassing their clients to determine if there were enough votes to move forward with a decertification vote on the union, agent and player sources told Yahoo! Sports.

[Related: Michael Jordan’s hardline stance could lengthen lockout]

Before proceeding, agents and players were waiting on the outcome of the weekend’s labor talks. Several agents and players believed support would grow for a vote on dissolving the union without significant progress on a deal.

Agents and players took part in two conference calls this week on the subject of decertification. Boston Celtics star Paul Pierce has taken a lead in spearheading those discussions, sources said.

“I’ve been ready to sign a decertification petition since July,” New Jersey Nets point guard Deron Williams tweeted early Sunday. “Can’t believe we are just now going this route!”

Several agents believe there’s enough support to get the necessary 30 percent of players (about 130) to sign a petition for a formal decertification vote, but agents and players are dubious about the ability to get more than the 50 percent of the union’s 450 members needed to eventually disband the union.

After the petition is filed, a 45-day waiting period is required before an actual vote. For the players, it’s a risky proposition, at best. The eventual dissolving of the union could lead to an antitrust lawsuit in federal court against the NBA, or merely the threat of it could push the owners to a more favorable agreement out of the uncertainty of how a court ruling could adversely affect the league.

After the league’s owners met in the morning to discuss their revenue-sharing plan, Saturday’s negotiating session was overseen by federal mediator George Cohen and lasted until 1:30 a.m. Sunday. Fisher said the players submitted a new proposal in which they would receive a 51 percent revenue split – down from the 52.5 percent they had been seeking and the 57 percent they received in the previous collective bargaining agreement – if they could reach agreement with the league on specific system issues. The players also suggested devoting an additional 1 percent of revenue to improving benefits for retired players.

Stern said the league’s latest offer was derived from compromises the mediator proposed in Saturday’s negotiating session and included a revenue split that would range from 49 to 51 percent for the players. Among the other issues in the league’s proposal:

• A “mini” midlevel exception for teams that cross the luxury-tax threshold that would be available every other year and have a starting salary of $2.5 million with a maximum of two years.

• A midlevel exception that would allow teams to give a player a starting salary of $5 million. The maximum contract lengths would alternate from four years to three every other year.

• No sign-and-trades for tax-paying teams.

[Related: NBA players consider decertifying union during lockout]

Fisher said Cohen didn’t present any formal ideas, instead making “what if” suggestions. The union also disagreed with the league’s description of its proposed revenue split, saying the players would never realistically receive 51 percent because the trigger mechanisms were too high.

“We just never had the sense they came in here trying to get this deal done,” Fisher said of the league’s owners.

With their ultimatum, the league’s owners hope to sway enough players into convincing the union to accept the deal. But Fisher said the offer isn’t even worthy of presenting to the players.

“There’s not a deal we can present to take a vote on,” Fisher said.

Union officials think the owners’ latest proposal continues to be pushed by a group of hardline small-market owners that includes Jordan. The union considers the penalties for tax-paying teams too restrictive and that the current proposal would take some of the league’s biggest-spending teams out of the market.

“It was a very frustrating, sad day,” Fisher said. “We, for sure, unequivocally made good-faith efforts to try to get this deal done tonight. We’re at a loss as to why we couldn’t close it out.”

[Grace]

NBA players reject owners' offer

November 8, 2011 | 3:03 pm

After a meeting with team representatives, the NBA players’ association on Tuesday rejected the league's latest contract offer.

After a 4 ½ hour meeting with 43 players and 29 of the 30 union representatives from NBA teams, players union President Derek Fisher and union Executive Director Billy Hunter said they had been given clear orders.

“Right now, the current offer that’s on the table from the NBA is not one that we can accept,” Fisher said in a news conference in New York.

Fisher and Hunter said they also were ordered to continue negotiating with NBA owners. Hunter said he would reach out to NBA Commissioner David Stern Tuesday night or Wednesday to see if they can set up a meeting.

Stern had given the players an ultimatum to accept the owners’ latest contract proposal by the close of business Wednesday or risk getting a weaker deal.

Fisher said they want to continue negotiating over the proposed split of basketball-related income. The players are seeking about 51% of the BRI, while Stern has offered about a 50% split.

However, Hunter said there are several other key issues to be resolved, including sign-and-trade restrictions by teams and the luxury tax penalty teams would pay for signing players.

“Without those improvements in the system, we don’t see a way of getting a deal done between now and the end of business tomorrow evening,” Fisher said.

Hunter said he'd heard through the “underground” that the NBA is considering canceling games through Christmas if no deal is reached by Wednesday. The NBA has already canceled games through November 30.

Hunter also said there was “very little discussion” Tuesday about possible union decertification.

Fisher said they all want to get a deal done so they can end the NBA lockout.

“But not under any circumstances will [we] negotiate from a position of weakness and being given ultimatums and demanded that we have to accept a particular deal,” Fisher said.


-- Broderick Turner

[Grace]

I think this about sums it all up. lol

[Michele]

Nov 8, 2011 19:16:32 GMT -6 Grace said:

I think this about sums it all up. lol

I agree! ;D

[Jerry]

... and STILL no end to the lockout...

us.cnn.com/2011/11/10/sport/nba-lockout/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

Hopefully they can find an agreement later today...

[Grace]

Talk's over: Players must choose between playing or decertifying

[Grace]

NBA Lockout: Top 5 NBA Players To Benefit from the Lockout

2. Dirk Nowitzki

[Grace]

N.B.A. Players Weigh Legitimacy of Latest Ultimatum

[Michele]

Well it doesn't look like there will be an NBA season anytime soon, if at all. The Player's Union have decided to reject the latest owners offer and decertify which means that the union is no longer and that the league will now be sued for antitrust violations. The whole bunch are IDIOTS and that's being polite. Anyway I vented a bit on my blog with an article included. So if you want to have a look mishasblue.blogspot.com/2011/11/no-nba-season.html

[Jerry]

I cannot believe there might not be a basketball season at all... But I'm so happy (and relieved) that the Mavs won the championship last year. If they hadn't, they couldn't afford a missing season with no opportunity to win the ring this year, since they're not getting any younger. That would've put even more pressure on them for next season...

Still, it's not great. I miss basketball, I'm sorry for all those players and arena stuff members who really need the season for their livelihoods...

I am not even sure who is to blame. Well, obviously both parties, since they weren't able to find a solution. But - and this is just my gut feeling and not biased on actual facts, since I'm a relatively basetball newbie - I have a slight suspicion that the owners like to sketch the picture of the "greedy basketball players", but I haven't seen the owners making any compromises, whereas the players... I also don't believe that the owners make more deficits than they could actually afford... Although I hope that most of the owners own a club because they're true fans of that club, in the end of the day it's still an investment and an enterprise/franchise that needs to pay off... And I cannot believe that the financial outlook is SO bad, otherwise they probably would try to get rid off it. Even though the sheer numbers and statistics do not look entirely good, there are ways to profit from loss (for tax reasons e.g.). So I take it with Churchill:
"The only statistics you can trust are those you falsified yourself"... ;D

But, as I said, since I'm lacking the knowledge as well as the facts and details, who knows...?!

But I have to say that it makes me suspicious, when David Stern tries to convince that "the greedy players" don't care about the fans AND the sport and that it is entirely their fault that there might be no season at all... Hmmm...

So, to cut a long story short: This situation is extremely unsatisfying!!!

[Michele]

The last offer the owners made was a 50-50 split. They were hoping that the players would turn that down as well and then the owners would offer a 53-47 offer, in favor of the owners. The players blindsided them with antitrust suit that's going to be coming, which in a way I'm glad the players did that but it's not helping keep other people employed. So this whole thing is screwy.